THIS WEEK: Colony Drop Again Victorious On ANNCast

As an aside to our readers, we’d like to make note of our appearance on ANNCast with Zac Bertschy. Sean, Jeff, and myself (Dave) spent about an hour and a half explaining “Why We Mad,” among other pressing community issues. Readers are advised to listen to the podcast and formulate their Internet arguments accordingly on either this post or the rather lively ANN comment thread.

30 Comments

  1. I archive-binged your site after listening to some of the podcast. This is pretty good stuff you have here. Keep up the good work.

  2. Awesome podcast, bros.

    PS: I raged a bit when some kid on the AAN forums posted that the word “Japtoon” was racially insensitive to Japanese-Americans. I’M Japanese-American, dammit, and I find the statement that “Japtoons is racist” is, in itself, racist.

    Goldang kids these days.

  3. That was a very entertaining ANNcast.

    I have to say, I do actually enjoy quite a lot of of the “review every episode” anime blogs, but I think that’s because I use them more as a way of keeping up with what’s coming out than as a source of entertainment.

  4. Meanwhile,last page or so of that ANNCast comment thread has been dedicated to exposing your rascist ways.

    P.S Nice podcast.

  5. Great podcast, guys–and yeah, it was fun to read the forums and see the moans and groans about how you were too cruel and other nonsense.

    Well, whatever. Glad to see–well, it should be “hear”–the folks behind one of the best anime sites around say their peace.

  6. The term “Jap” definitely is considered rude in Britain. There’s a joke in The IT Crowd where Chris Morris bellows out “The Jap loves it!” during a meeting with a Japanese business partner, that wouldn’t work if we didn’t all feel slightly uncomfortable at the word.

    Rather than making the point that it’s not as offensive in Britain and Australia (possibly true, but by and large we still know we shouldn’t say it, in the UK at least), I always felt the term “Japtoons” was funny for pretty much the same reason. It’s taking a word like “Japanimation” and extending the thought process to an extreme where it makes people uncomfortable. With the added bonus that you get to make a dig at the some of the pretensions that anime fans clutch to themselves so dearly. You kind of let them get away with that criticism more than perhaps you needed to.

  7. To Ian, I want to ask this: So you think “Japtoons” is funny because of the racial implications inherent in the word, and that suddenly “anime” as a word is now too pretentious a word to describe Japanese animation? Is that really all it boils down to, upsetting anime fans?

    And to Tofubeast, speaking as the “kid” (I’m 27) who spoke about that, I have to congratulate you for making a statement that officially bends the entire debate around and shoves it up its own arse in the name of Colony Drop. Congratulations.

  8. A Podcast about anime blogs. Great.

    Didn’t you guys realise how boring your discussion was?

  9. @Robert Kelly:

    “Is that really all it boils down to, upsetting anime fans?”

    Well no, but I am a firm believer in upsetting people who take anime far, far too seriously.

    Look, I got the whole “Jap go home, wished you died in the war” and “Ew you watch those Japanese porn cartoons” shpeil when I was a kid, so I know where Colony Drop’s ironic (ugh, I feel hipster just by using the word) use of “Japtoon” comes from.

    It’s a tongue-in-cheek potshot, reminds those from the old guard of fandom about the negative connotations anime used to have (or still has), makes fun of the people who still don’t get it, and like Ian said, is a nudge at the new fandom, who tends to take a holier-then-thou approach to anime and their fellow fans in general.

    And really, if you can’t make fun of yourself once in a while, that’s kinda sad.

  10. @Robert Kelly

    You’re being deliberately reductive in a rather tiresome way, but yes, the racial implication of “Japtoons” is part of what makes it funny. Just in case you didn’t catch what I said before, it’s funny because we know it’s wrong. There’s a difference between this sort of reflexive meta-humour and the sort of straightforward mean spirited joke that says, “Ha, ha, stupid Japs with your weird, different culture,” that I would hope most people with an ounce of critical thinking would be able to detect.

    And I didn’t say “anime” was pretentious. Anime is just what we call it, right? As I said, it’s a pun on the endearing and old fashioned term “Japanimation”, with the “animation” part replaced by “toon” in order to make fun of the sort of pretentious anime fan cliche that says, “It’s not cartoons: it’s animation!”

    It’s really not that hard to understand, and it does rather take the fun out of it to have to explain it.

    No one’s demanding that anime fandom as a whole adopt the term, but if you don’t like it, at least let’s have less of the disingenuous “Ooh, bad racism!” mock outrage.

  11. Ian and Tofubeast summed it up better than I could. CD’s something you either get or you don’t. If a thoroughly ironic use of a long-obsolete derogatory term for anime is enough in your mind to overwhelm the legitimate arguments we make, then you probably weren’t going to listen to our opinion anyway.

    Whether or not we conceded to this trumped-up “controversy” by ceasing to use “Japtoons” or “Japanese rape cartoons”, you wouldn’t really care, because it’s not about elevating the dialogue. It’s about somehow shaming Mean Old Colony Drop off the Internet and thereby saving the blogosphere from our (imaginary) ravages…which is NEVER going to happen.

    People keep trying to come up with analogues for our role in the commmunity, alternately insulting (Rush Limbaugh) or unintentionally flattering (Jeremy Clarkson…I love that guy because I’m not British). I think the best parallel I could draw between CD and any other vaguely controversial media entity would be the Wu-Tang Clan (a #colonydrop favorite).

    We keep it real. We keep it old-school. We’re focused on the fundamentals. We call out the fake-ass MCs and industry hypocrites. We’re not that popular with the kids (even as we try to teach truth to the youth). We have our internal disagreements and solo projects, but we still share a unity of purpose that binds us all to this site. And we use all that noble rhetoric to underly a brilliant long-term promotion strategy, that will eventually make most of us rich and famous.

    Shame on otaku who try to run game on otaku. I’ll fuck yo’ ass up.

  12. I find it interesting that most of your responses to my simple point is mostly rabid self-promotion, as if the Colony Drop brand is something you think you can bring out of a tiny little blog spouting out invective. Are you people trying to be the next Danny Choo or something?

    And also, I guess I should personally say that the “reflexive meta humour” that CD employs doesn’t actually work for me, unless they really do see the Japanese a sub-human beings. Judging by some of Sean’s articles on Japanese fans, I’m not sure if I’m far off the mark. The fact you seem to see racism less as actual controversy and more of a way to advertise yourself as a brand makes you less of a blog in my eyes. It’s like you’ve watched All in The Family, and forgotten that Archie Bunker isn’t supposed to be the one who’s always right. Or, for that matter, Denholm Reynholm (played by Chris Morris) in The IT Crowd.

    I’ve never really intended to actually trying to force Colony Drop off the internet, mainly because the circle of back-patting that it’s currently steeping in would prevent that from happening. I only want to make my views certain. If it wasn’t for Tofubeast specifically calling me out, I would have just stayed on the ANN thread.

    You’re not the Wu-Tang Clan. You’re not Rush Limbaugh, or Jeremy Clarkson. to me, you’re just a bunch of ageing anime fanboys just like me, except you’re bitter that Yoshiaki Kawajiri hasn’t directed anything since Highlander: Search for Vengeance, and there hasn’t been more Cowboy Bebop since the last one. That’s what I think.

  13. It doesn’t really matter, trying to have a discussion with R. Kelly or the other obsessive CD fan on Twitter. They’ve got their personal crusade (STOP THE DROP) and the discussions aren’t really about anything else.

    The question on the podcast about “aren’t you just cyberbullying a 16-year-old girl” wasn’t about a 16-year-old girl, it was about “I GOT THESE GUYS! I GOT ‘EM WITH THIS ONE”.

    They’ll keep reading absolutely everything we do and they’ll keep up the crusade. If not in the comments section here, in the comments section on ANN or some other website or to anybody who’ll listen. Kind of a no-lose situation for us, honestly: like having a sort of reverse-psychology PR team.

  14. @Robert Kelly

    You do know that there’s a difference between Archie Bunker and Carroll O’Connor, right? Or indeed between Alf Garnett and Warren Mitchell if we’re going to be proper old-skool about this?

    Oh, and if we’re playing “gotcha”:

    “I guess I should personally say that the “reflexive meta humour” that CD employs doesn’t actually work for me, unless they really do see the Japanese as sub-human beings.”

    Does this mean that CD humour would work for you if they really did “see the Japanese as sub-human beings”?

    No, of course it doesn’t, but see what I can do by deliberately taking your words out of context and how easy it is to reverse the intentions behind them?

    “you’re just a bunch of ageing anime fanboys just like me, except you’re bitter that Yoshiaki Kawajiri hasn’t directed anything since Highlander: Search for Vengeance, and there hasn’t been more Cowboy Bebop since the last one. That’s what I think.”

    Funny, because that’s pretty much exactly what Sean said in the podcast. Maybe you don’t disagree that much after all.

  15. As sad as having to explain your usage of the term “Japtoons” might be.

    That you are actually explaining it is far worse. You guys seem to be ambitious but here you definately lacked balls.

    Then I read this

    The question on the podcast about “aren’t you just cyberbullying a 16-year-old girl” wasn’t about a 16-year-old girl, it was about “I GOT THESE GUYS! I GOT ‘EM WITH THIS ONE”.

    and thought “whelp, maybe you are just a provocative douchebag” (I read through your SOS site and this piece of self absorbed, retarded bullcrap belongs right there)

    Seriously get over yourself.

    Anyways some of the articles up here are quite readable (which means a lot on the internet) and I am glad that the ANN podcast brought me here
    (the articles over there are often kinda dull).

    Keep up the good work.

  16. @ RKelly – “I guess I should personally say that the “reflexive meta humour” that CD employs doesn’t actually work for me…” I guess you should just take CD off your bookmarks then eh.

    @ Ben – o/

    FUCK AUSTRALIA

    OFWGKTA

  17. Nono: I want to explain that statement in case it was misread. Here is the situation I’m talking about.

    A reader (one who cannot stop talking about us – http://twitpic.com/4q88z3) went and did a background check on a submitted post that we put up over at SOS. Because the post turned out to come from a teenage girl with body image issues, the reader cast us as bullying her personally. Like I said on the podcast, I find this disingenuous, to say the least.

    I can see how you might call this point of view self-absorbed or paranoid, but there’s a history behind it and we know very well that the question’s intent was to make us look like monsters.

    If you didn’t misread it, well, I’m sure I didn’t change your mind with all this. Thanks for enjoying the site.

  18. I may have overreacted (I certainly did)

    But to see where i am coming from I will elaborate on my point.

    I found the intent of the question to be despicable.
    “isnt that cyberbullying?” oh how innocent… (you can add the unsaid “and as a good citizen isnt it my duty to report this?”)

    It is horrifying how far off from reality internet debates sometimes are:

    Someone dislikes a blog and he uses the “inferiority complex towards anime characters of a 16 year old girl (goddamn this sounds sad)” as a pretense to attack the staff of said blog (way to be classy)

    You have all right to be upset.

    But putting all the malicious intent and the manipulative nature of this question aside
    Your response felt like you were victimizing yourself.

    Maybe I am just too sensitive
    I read through SOS and laughed a lot (feeling guilty sometimes) but this qoute was just too sad for me

    it would have been far more sensible of ABCBTom (I read the link you gave me)
    to just contact the members here personally.

    Well putting this question in a podcast on a site with over 500000 members (he sure shied no effort to protect this girl from evil internet bullies).

    I think I wrote too much already
    it won´t get better.

    I have read a little more and definately like what I see.

    But the greatest delight is the absence of an avatar function in the comments.
    Otherwise I would have invalidated each of my posts by using a Nichijou avatar.
    Some of the jokes are just pure gold.

  19. @Ian: Yes, you’re just bolstering my point. With Archie Bunker and Alf Garnett, and Deynholm Reynholm, you’re supposed to be laughing AT them. Them and their bigotry is the butt of the joke. You’re not supposed to sympathise with them. With Colony Drop, you’re laughing WITH them, and you’re supposed to take their “scathing aimless attack” to heart.

    @Mr. Skinner: If I take them off my bookmarks, how am I supposed to know what kind of bile CD is spouting recently?

    @Dave: For what it’s worth, I apologise for my last comment about judging you all from Sean’s articles on this site. It was insulting, not really all that true, and it was wrong for me to bring all of you fine writers at Colony Drop down to Sean’s depths. For that I am truly sorry.

    That being said, you’re not helping yourself any right now with the whole thing with the girl with the body image issues on SOS. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day.

  20. @Robert Kelly

    It only bolsters your point if you continue to insist that the aim of CD’s joke is to victimise “Japs”, which it obviously is not. I’ve explained this three times now and you still return to the same simplistic reading of the word. Do you genuinely not understand the difference between the term “Japtoons”, an anime community meta-joke that adopts (contrary to the writer’s own view, in the same way Warren Mitchell is not the same as Alf Garnett) an exaggerated voice of the kind of antiquated, orientalising way that anime was marketed in the past, and the use of “Japs” as a term of racist abuse directed at the Japanese? Seriously?

    Yeah, it’s also a deliberate red rag to the more simple-minded cut-and-paste type anime kids, and it is fun watching them go potty over it, but you’re, you know, an adult.

    I know I’m banging on about this, but I’m genuinely baffled that anyone (least of all someone familiar with the work of Chris Morris) wouldn’t get this.

  21. The ANN cast brought me here actually. I was won over by a group of ageing anime fans who were a) literate, b) seemingly intelligent and c) quite annoyed with the apparent deterioration in quality of Japacartons.

    You keep writing, I’ll keep reading.

  22. @Robert Kelly

    You are a fake character created by Sean to mock his more delusional critics and I claim my five pounds.

  23. >>You’re not the Wu-Tang Clan. You’re not Rush Limbaugh, or Jeremy Clarkson. to me, you’re just a bunch of ageing anime fanboys just like me, except you’re bitter that Yoshiaki Kawajiri hasn’t directed anything since Highlander: Search for Vengeance, and there hasn’t been more Cowboy Bebop since the last one. That’s what I think.

    Yea, at the old bitter age of 25, I want Kawajiri at the top of the anime food chain too.

    Which speaking of Kawajiri, I so called that in my mind when it came to that question of “which anime director would direct Die Hard” before it was said out loud by a mere 5 seconds. I mean, technically speaking, Kawajiri did tackle Die Hard already with Goku: Midnight Eye and Cyber City Oedo, but as a mere interpretation. Sengoku is just the Cyber City version of Detective John McClane.

  24. Enjoyed the Podcast, guys.Keep writin’n’talkin’, Colony Drop. You’re a rare breed.

  25. This was a great podcast- thanks Colony Drop crew for remaining WINNING in all forms of Japtoon Media. Can’t wait to see what is next.

  26. @Robert Kelly: You’re trying to make a point here, but slam dunk’n hoes is a perfectly acceptable pastime if you right about yo paper and you stay on yo grind.

    >>>Shame on otaku who try to run game on otaku. I’ll fuck yo’ ass up.

    Wu-Tang goes with everything.

  27. Dear staff of colonydrop,

    i found the podcast and the threads it spawned quite enlightening. i need to ask this question. do you welcome people to poke holes at you on this site until they win their petty argument, or would you prefer people to ignore your site completely and talk about you incessantly on social networks like twitter or facebook?

    sincerely,

    a fan

  28. Having only recently found Colony Drop (more like, having recently started even looking at blogs regarding this anime thing I’ve been losing interest in for the last few years), being able to listen to CD on this podcast was genuinely pretty entertaining. At the risk of sounding too impressed, you sound smart, and regardless of whether or not I agree with everything I’ve read here, there is one important thing you have on CD that I just don’t see in other blogs: You give a shit about the pieces of entertainment you’re critiquing, and not JUST because it is a cartoon from Japan, not JUST because it is a particular series, era, or year.

    I have got to ask, and I understand you are in no obligation to answer of course, has CD considered blogging about Ghost in the Shell: SAC and 2nd GIG? I think your perspective on it would make for an interesting read.

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